Listen to the full interview here ( 53:53 minutes)
Welcome to accelerate your business growth with your host, Diane Helbig. Diane is a leading small business development and leadership coach, author and speaker who is passionate about sharing valuable ideas, tips, and techniques with business professionals worldwide. Diane brings you the world’s experts and gurus and all things business, whether it’s sales structure, social media planning, or plateauing. Guests bring their expertise and energy to each episode when growing your businesses, your focus accelerate your business. Growth is the show to listen to God a topic or guest suggestion. Let Diane know. The goal is to make sure you have the information you need to move your business forward. Thanks for joining us. Settle in and enjoy.
Hey everybody. Thank you so much for joining us today. Show is sponsored by audible.com. Audible Dot com is a leading provider of spoken audio entertainment and information. Listen to audio books whenever and wherever you want. Get a free book when you sign up for a 30 day free firstname.lastname@example.org slash business growth. We are so thrilled that this podcast is gaining recognition as a resource for business and entrepreneurs from MSNBC. Is Your Business to inc com to a whole host of other sites worldwide? Accelerate your business growth podcast is enjoying inclusion on lists of the best podcasts to listen to. I owe all of that. Of course. It has a totally attributed to the guests that we have had on this podcast over the past many years. Today. We have one of those guests with us today. We have Tom Schwab. Tom knows how to build an online business.
Marketing at its heart is starting a conversation with someone who could be an ideal customer. Tom Helps small business owners, entrepreneurs and solopreneurs get featured on leading podcasts they’re prospects are already listening to. Then he shows them how to turn listeners into customers. He’s the author of podcast guests. Profits grow your business with a targeted interview strategy and he’s the founder of interview Valet, the concierge level booking service. And uh, before I actually welcome into the podcast, they do have to say that I have had the pleasure of working with, I think a handful of folks over at interview valet and they’re fabulous. So, and the guests that they send are marvelous. So quick little plug for you guys, you guys are doing a great job so thanks for joining me Tom.
Well Diane, I am thrilled to be here at Du. I just hope I live up to all the previous guests you have that have brought you to where you are here and to. We’ll definitely have a lot of fun with this. I love podcasts. I and especially when I get to be the guest and you do all the hard work so thank you in advance for that.
Hey, you’re welcome. You think I’m going to do all the hard work but just hang in there for a moment. This is. This is one of my favorite topics and not because I do a podcast but because I don’t think people realize the power of being a guest on a podcast. So I’m thrilled that we are talking about this and so it was really actually leads me to my first question which is why is it that podcast interviews confer, convert? What is it 25 times better than blogs do?
And a lot of people look at that statistic and go, that couldn’t be right. But if you start thinking about what it is you thinking, wow, it must be right because if you think about it, people you know, convert when they know, like, and trust you, right? So that’s what moves them along. And so if you, if you’re reading a blog, you come across to blogging, how much time are you spending on it? If you read the whole thing, maybe it’s a few minutes if you’re just skimming it and maybe it’s a minute. So from that standpoint, you really don’t have that much of an investment in it. You don’t know much about that person. A, you’re not quite sure is this for me. So a lot of times the blog traffic that you get, um, it doesn’t convert as well. And even when they do convert on leads, they don’t close as well.
Now compare that to um, let’s go to the other extreme. When you actually meet somebody live there are introduced to you by a friend and said, Diane, you need to meet this person. You need to work with them. Well, what’s the, what would you expect conversion rate to that be that probably be, you know, at least to be a come a lead that would probably be up near 100 percent, right? So now you’ve got a blog or a podcast interviews that are sorta in the middle of that, right? So now people are listening to somebody they know, like, and trust a friend, you know, but people listened to to you, Diane, all the time. They like you, they respect you. So if you’re bringing somebody to them and they get to hear this person for 30 or 45 minutes, a couple of things happen, right? So either they go, wow, that was really interesting.
Uh, and they move on from there. Or if they decide that, like that person, I like what they’re doing, they could help me. I could see working with that person and they go to that person’s website, that traffic is going to convert much better. And so that’s why we’re seeing conversion rates of 25 to 50 percent from visitors to leads from podcast interviews. The other thing that we’re seeing is that the sales cycle is so much shorter, right? Because if somebody already heard you for 30 or 45 minutes, they sort of know what your, your heart is, who you work with, what you do. So it’s a much more of an intimate discussion and people, you know, come to the website knowing who you are and that they want to work with you. Uh, so to me, uh, once you start looking at it at that, at that standpoint, you’re like, oh, of course it makes sense.
Boy. No kidding. And it reminds me of, um, like people will ask me where does most of my business comes from? And it comes from public speaking because for that very reason I can be in front of an audience. They can decide whether I’m someone they want to engage with. They can see the, if I know what I’m talking about, you know, there’s more of that. It’s a quicker connection than people reading my articles online. And so being a podcast guest on podcasts, same thing only it gives you a, an even broader reach than speaking at a local event.
I’ve always said it’s the easy way to do it. And I was honest before, when people say, why don’t you do your own podcast? I say, because it’s a lot of work, you know, um, anybody that says it’s easy or a has either never done it or never done it. Well, and you know, Diane, my hat’s off to you because I know there’s a lot of work that goes into this, but with that is like being a guest, it’s so much easier because you get the benefits. And then also from the standpoint of podcasts are so great because you don’t have to travel any place. And a lot of times I’ll talk with, uh, with potential clients and say, would you drive across town right now to speak to 10 clients? Would you drive across state to speak with 100? You know, would you jump in an airplane to speak to a thousand? And a lot of them are like, Oh, you know, I don’t want to speak in front of 100 people. And you’re like, well, don’t worry, you can do it over a microphone and you can do it from home. Uh, so it’s very powerful from that standpoint.
Yeah. It’s. Now explain to me why you say that you should focus on fewer leads.
This is one that, uh, uh, I almost was stoned as being a heretic for, but I was speaking in an event, um, and once again, this, speaking of that came from somebody here with me on a podcast and the panel was up there talking about, well, you know, you need to get 75 leads a day to keep your business going and this is what you need to do. And they came to me and I’m like, um, I couldn’t handle 75 new customers a day, uh, you know, I, I’d be great with, with just a few leads a day. And they came back and said, no, we’re not talking about customers, which just talking about leads. And I’m like, well, why would I want somebody to be a lead? Why would I want to spend their time and my time nurturing them if they couldn’t be a great customer?
Right? Ultimately, our goal is to serve people not just to get more leads. So I think the real goal is I’m thinking about how we can that ideal person, how we can engage them, uh, not just, uh, a numbers game, you know, it’s, um, it’s like you can’t eat a facebook live like, and if you’ve got 2 million twitter followers, that means nothing. Give me 10 thrilled customers and that’ll grow your business faster than anything. So with this, with targeted podcast interviews, uh, I think you get fewer leads, but you get better leads that convert better. And, uh, ultimately our better customers, right? Because as we’re talking on any podcast, you get a sense of who I am and maybe you don’t like my humor and that’s okay, that’s fine. That doesn’t mean I’m bad or you’re bad, but this is who I am. So if you’re like, I can’t see myself working with that person, let’s find. Ultimately, we all want to attract our ideal clients are ideal customers, not just another lead.
Yep. Yep. I love that. I bet. Thank you so much for sharing that. I think too many people are in that and that’s an old mindset, you know, that mindset of you have to have a whole lot in the pipeline and then widdle it down. Really went away when social media really became a marketing vehicle because now you can really go where your target audience is and communicate with them directly. So if you can be more specific about it. And also, you know, sometimes I call it the difference between activity and productivity activity is you call 40 people, right? Act Our productivity as you investigate and you only reach out to the ones that really you have something to talk to them about. So that’s what that feels like.
Oh, I love that. Uh, uh, that definition or that comparison there, I always say that the worst business advice I ever got, Diana came from my grandfather and it was the only wrong thing that old Irishman ever told me. I was probably 17 years old and he told me, choose carefully who you drink with because you can’t choose who you work with now, for him that was true, right? He was a mechanic and a small town. If you came to him with the car, you were one of his customers. He couldn’t be choosy. But for us the world is so much different. Right? We’ve got access to millions and billions of potential customers and we can’t serve them all. Nor should we try. We should be very specific on, hey, here’s the kind of people that, you know, ignite my soul. I love working with them and I bring them the best results and you can build a huge business on that. So it’s not a numbers game. But just finding, hey, who are my ideal customers, how can I engage with them? And I have you do that. You’ll be happier. Your customers will be happy, happier, and I think also think you’ll be much more profitable.
I really like looking at it that way because I, you know, so I was going to say that, um, there’s so many, it’s so competitive out there, there’s so many people doing the same thing that you, you want to really be able to target who you work best with, but I really liked the way you said that, that if you think about who really fills your soul, who you really enjoy working with, just changes that dynamic, that thought process.
And I think the thought process too is how you view yourself in the marketplace. Right? And um, so for us, you know, um, interview valet, is it a, you know, or one of a million PR firms? Uh, I’m one of a million marketing firms now. We don’t look at ourselves at that, at that way. You know, I look at it as what we do. We really don’t have competition, right? Because we’ve narrowed it down so much. We do one thing, we do podcast interview marketing and that, you know, we do that with excellence. That’s our zone of genius. And then we’ve even narrowed it down from there onto, you know, what kind of clients we work with and what kind of verticals we’re in. So we really focus in three verticals and it’s not so much where our customers are, but where their ideal prospects are and those are business faith and Christianity and health and nutrition and wellness.
A couple of weeks ago I got approached a, a, a, a comedian guys, real life professional comedian and everything called me up and we were talking and I said, I can see how podcast, interview marketing, you could use that in order to get more gigs, get more people following you, really take your comedy tour to the next level. But I said, we’re not the people to do that, you know, the people that we focus on those verticals. Um, I don’t see how a comedian could go in there and leverage that. So I said, get the book out. In fact, I sent him the book. I’m like, read it. You can figure this out or you can find an agency that may want to do this. But I said, we’re not the agency for you. That’s not our vertical. Now, if, if I get a call from 50 more comedians, that might be a vertical we expanded to, but right now it’s like, no, he’s a good person. I have a good person, but we’re not a good fit.
Yeah, that’s great. So talk about what podcast interview marketing actually is, because I think I would say probably a good number of my listeners don’t know.
Well, if you go back to marketing at its heart is starting a conversation with somebody that could be an ideal customer. I spent way too many years and tens of thousands of dollars get into an MPA until afterwards found out, oh, that’s what marketing is. So think about how you’re doing that. So when people are doing facebook marketing, okay, they’re trying to start a conversation. When they’re doing email marketing, they’re trying to start a conversation and it’s the same thing with podcast interview marketing. So you’re using podcast interviews to start a conversation, but with that also just realize that it’s not just the interview. The interview is the fuel, you know, in content marketing. We’ll talk about content being the fuel and if you have just fuel and no engine to put it into, you’ll get a lot of lights. You got some heat, but you’ll never get work out of it.
So really podcast interview marketing is just a system by which you can use interviews, uh, to drive your sales and marketing system. And really there’s six steps to it that we figured out, you know, the first is prospecting, finding the right shows that have your ideal customers. The second one is pitching, right? Approaching those hosts in such a way as they understand the offer or the value you bring to them and to their audience. The third step is preparation. You know, nobody wants to go step on stage and Cleveland and say Hello Columbus. That’s it. It’s not going to convert well that way. So preparation is knowing who, uh, who the host is, what the podcast is about, um, who the audience is, what questions they may be asking you so that you go in there prepared in order to give your, uh, your best, uh, best interview.
And also helping the host prepare, right? That they’re, they’re busy, they’re doing, they’re doing a lot of work, so don’t make them work for finding out who you are. So there’s that preparation of, you know, if you’ve got a book, make sure that they know that, uh, if, if you know, if you want to speak on certain things that you think could help the audience, help them know that I’m this. Then the last track here, the fourth step is the performance and the performance is the one thing that you can’t, that you can’t delegate. You can’t outsource, you know, Sinatra only sang and uh, you know, that was the thing that he did great. So like with our clients, that’s what they focus on. How can they do the podcast interviews and while they can’t outsource that, we can help them with best practices. The fifth step is his progression and here’s where it really comes into more of a inbound marketing perspective.
And so how do you get people and to move them from being passive listeners to active visitors of your website. And ultimately to turn into leads. And I’ll pull the curtain back and I’ll show you. Okay, so if I was talking about this, you know, um, the six steps to podcast interview marketing, I could say, well, you know, and if you’re interested, if you’re, if you’re trying to write these down, don’t worry, they’re all back at the website. I, you know what, Diane, I’ll make a, a page for all of your audience here. Just go to interview valet.com forward slash bg for accelerate your business growth and that everything in Diane and I talk about will be there including the stuff about the six steps of podcast interview marketing. Now that was the progression, right? I’ve given people a reason to go from just listening in order to actually visiting the site and hopefully downloading something that could bring them value. Then the sixth step in podcast, interview marketing is really the promotion. You know, this is great content. Um, it’s gonna live on for Evergreen content. We’re recording this in 2017, but I guarantee you right now in 2020, somebody is listening to this Diane and going, this is great. So with this, you always want to keep promoting great episodes and uh, because what’s, you know, what’s old is new to somebody else. So we also make sure that, uh, uh, we’re always promoting the episodes on shelves for media.
That’s fascinating. Thank you so much for sharing that. I always learned something, at least one thing when I have people on the, um, progression, like I, people do it all the time. I guess I just never really thought about it and oddly enough, I’m not quite sure why, but that makes so much sense, mean promotion. I get. Um, and, and so let’s talk about, because one of these is, you know, in the pitching and talk about how important it is to know who you’re pitching to and that you’re relevant to their audience.
I have often thought if I was going to do a podcast, I would just have somebody with like a Morgan Freeman voice, reading the bad pitches that get forwarded onto me from podcast friends. And think about it, if you’re listening here as a podcast listener, put yourself in Diane shoes right now, right? So she’s busy, she’s doing a podcast. What’s going to get you interviewed on accelerate your business growth. It’s not going to be a spammy email. It’s not going to be one of selfserving of, Hey, I’ve got this book, I want to promote this. Nope. Um, it’s, it’s, it’s to be something that’s a relational and I guarantee you it’s probably a cold email is not going to do it because the host gets to pretty much choose who they want on their podcast. So who would you choose if you had a podcast? You’d have your friends and those people that you thought were interesting, the people that you wanted to talk to.
So if you start to reverse engineer that, what would be the great way to, uh, to start? Well, the first thing would be to listen to the podcast, right? Find out if it’s good for you. Find out if you could add value to it. Then you could make a comment. You know, when you hear podcasts all the time saying, leave us a review and rating on Itunes, that means a lot to them. If you do that, I guarantee you any podcaster reads the rating and reviews, they will know who you are. Go connect with them on social media, take a couple of their tweets, their facebook posts, like on retreat, retweet them, start to build that relationship. Then reach out and say, Hey, you know, I’ve listened to the podcast, um, I think that I could bring this value to your audience. Um, and this is how I would like to help you, right?
Because your goal on being a podcast guest is to make the host look like a genius for invite or inviting you. If you can do that, boy, uh, you’ll get invited on more podcasts, you’ll get promoted all the rest of that. So sort of take the tables and flip it around and say, how can I get on a podcast and flip it around and say, how can I help the podcaster? And if you just come with that, that servant’s heart and that longterm, I’m more relational as opposed to a short term transactional, a life gets a lot more fun. You make a lot more friends and you’ll be a lot more successful.
Thank you so much for sharing that. It is all absolutely true. Every last bit of it. It has to be able to connect and you really have to have information that really is relevant to that audience. You know, a lot of the. I mean, you’re right. I get a lot of pitches from people who think I would be, you know, they liked the show. I’d be a great guest on your show. Say What are you talking about? And then they’ll tell me it’s time. I’m thinking, okay, well no you won’t. And, and one of, sorry, one of my, um, uh, guiding principles has been, I’ve been when, when this airs, I will have been doing this for seven years and one of my guiding principles is always been I will not compromise what, who I, you know, with who I have on, they have to really be valuable to the audience because that’s why I started this thing in the first place. So, you know, it doesn’t matter if they’re my friend. None of you know, nothing that doesn’t have the latest book out. It has to be relevant
because it’s your credibility. You’ve worked seven years to build this. And uh, I would also warn people, there’s sometimes where people will say, well, I got on a podcast and then they wonder why the podcast never went live. And, uh, you’d be amazed how many recordings get lost, um, didn’t turn out. And what it is, is the host just is like, no, I’m sorry that you didn’t earn a right to speak to my audience. You know, nobody likes an infomercial. So if you get on there, you know, trying to, you know, just sell something and, and take a, you’re not gonna, you’re not gonna have success. And um, it, it, I, I was talking with somebody the other day and one of the phrases that I’ve always loved is that marketers mess up everything, right? And, uh, I think I first heard it from Gary Vaynerchuk and he didn’t use the word mess up, but if you know Gary v, you can pick out what he said.
But it’s true. I mean, when the first billboards went up, people would drive to see the next billboard and then all of a sudden they put up a million and it’s like, oh, that stinks. When, when radio and television came out, people used to look forward to the commercials. When we first started to get email, you’d get this alert, you’ve got mail and you’d look forward to it. And then it turned to spam. And so marketers mess up everything. And I somewhat wonder if podcasting could be the last bastion that marketers can’t mess up because it’s so transparent. You can see what somebody’s motives are for 30 or 45 minutes if they’re in it for themselves or, um, you know, actually trying to serve. And what I love is that I’ve seen a lot of people enter podcasting as hosts that were successful in other areas but didn’t do well. And then I’ve seen other people that are just genuinely nice men and women and they’re the ones that are doing well in podcasting. So I’m hoping, I’m hopeful for this medium. Been a sort of so transparent, uh, that marketers can’t mess it up. And that nice guys and gals finished first.
Yeah, me too. I have more questions for you. Accelerate your business growth podcast is happy to be sponsored by audible.com. Audible Dot com is a leading provider of spoken digital audio entertainment and information. They have over 150,000 titles to choose from and you can listen to them on any device, including whatever you’re hearing us on right now. If you sign up at our link, which is audible trial.com/business growth, you get one free audio book and a one month trial of the service. Some examples of books you can listen to on audible.com are the secret of peak productivity by tomorrow miles and the go giver by Bob Burg. So visit audible trial.com/business growth. Explore the books that are of interest to you and receive one free audiobook when you sign up for the trial. Today we’re talking to Tom Schwab about the value of podcast interview marketing. Now, Tom, um, you said something a ago that made me think of something that may sort of be a segway. I’m not sure if it is, but you claim that every strategy has an expiration date and something that you just said about, um, well, we always billboards and I thought, okay, you know, people went to find the next billboard, but now we see them everywhere for some reason that made me think of this expiration date thing. So why is it that every strategy strategy has an expiration date and what is it that marketers will kill podcast? What do you think’s going to, if anything, going to kill podcasting?
Well, it sort of becomes normal to everybody and once everybody starts doing it, it’s harder to stand out. Um, and, and sometimes it’s just different times, different markets, right? So billboards worked for their time and then it sort of ran its course, um, you know, television, radio, email, all the rest of that, uh, at one time the conversions rates are that were astronomical and then it got more competitive, it got more saturated, all the rest of that. And so a lot of the times I think you’ve got to learn why something is working, not necessarily how can I copy this? And one of the examples that I often use is dying. If I told you that yesterday I went to the grocery store and line two works lying to is the fastest line you need to go there. Well, it’s not that I’m lying to you.
In fact I’m really trying to help you, but it’s a different market and it’s a different time. So really what you’ve got to do is learn from that and say, okay, why was lying to la? Why did that one work? What things did you see? How could, how could I apply that to what I’m doing right now? And I think a lot of times as a, as business owners, when we’re trying to look to accelerate our business growth, we look at something that’s a different market and a different time. So I think with anything that I’m, that you hear what I’m saying right now, don’t, don’t trust me, test it. Think about it would, would this work for your market and take the principles that apply to that. Now there could be different principles so you don’t have to do it, you know, just the same way I’m doing it.
Could you take these principles and use it as for interviews in your local area? Now that might work there. People will say, well, you know, podcast, interview marketing, could I use that on television and radio? And I’m like, the same principles should apply. The biggest thing that’s a difference though is the fundamental market, right? So podcasts are based on content. So if you’ve got great content, that’s something you can offer. A television and radio are different because it’s a revenue based system. It’s an advertising system. And if I, if I called the local radio station today and said, I’ve got great information for your audience and I’d love to share it, I guarantee you it’d be the sales department that would call me back and they’d say if you buy this much advertisement will get you on the 5:00 AM news and if you buy this much, advertising will get you on the 5:00 PM news. So with that, it’s just, I’m a whatever strategy you’re looking at, whatever tactic you’re looking at, um, try to understand why it worked in that market and why a might work in yours.
That’s great. Thanks. I totally get that. Let’s talk about, um, the different kinds of podcasts and how they work really. And I’m curious if you think podcasts more interview marketing works for everybody, but I’m talking about the smaller niche podcast as opposed to the more general one
and I think, will it work for everyone? I would say there hasn’t been a niche. We haven’t tested that it didn’t work for now. Some it works better for others. I think if you’ve got a very, very geographically based business, it could be a lot tougher. Right? So talking to somebody recently that was a home inspector, right? But his market is pretty much an hour’s drive around where he lives now. He could use that in order to, um, you know, uh, get more back, links to his site, get more credibility, all the rest of that. But you know, if you’re not an hour away from him, you’ll probably never be a customer. Now that being said, there are some very niche podcasts back. There’s a realtor right now that’s a starting down in Nashville. He starting a podcast down. They’re just focused on all of the people that are moving to Nashville.
Nice. Perfect for him. And you know, that same realtor or I’m sorry, not a real at or home inspector boy, if he was in the Nashville area, that is a podcast that I would want to get on there. So I think you just have to look at what your goals are and where your audience is a. there’s another podcasts out there called Great Lakes stories and it’s just stories from around the Great Lakes. And you’d say, well what good would that podcast ever do? Me? Well, it’s also picked up by every little um, radio station around the Great Lakes and they repurpose it and they, they put it out there. So if you’ve got a, a, a, an advertisement, if you’ve got a product, if you’ve got a service that could help those people, that might be a great podcast for you. And so often it’s not, it’s not more people, it’s not how many people can I get seen by, but how many of the right people.
So I sometimes I joke around and say, um, you know, would you like to have five minutes on the super bowl where you could talk to everybody? And a lot of people would say, Oh yeah, that would be great. I’m like, not me, you know, because those people want nothing to do with what I have to say. I’m interruption an interruption. They would heckle me, they’d make fun of me, I could bring them no value, right? So, but give me five minutes in a conference room with 10 people that I could really help that would be much more productive. And sometimes, you know, I’ve even had it with my own experience. And uh, early on I was on a, a podcast that had 40,000 downloads, great podcast. I loved being there. Uh, and this is back when, before we had a done for you service, it was just selling informational product and from there, you know, 40,000 listeners, um, I got about two dozen leads.
I was thrilled to be there and I appreciated every one of those will. Shortly after that I was on a podcast and the host told me that she had 350 downloads per episode. And I’m like, well, we’re here. I am, you know, I, I love your podcast. I think it’s the ideal audience for me. You know, Diane from that 350 downloads, I got a hundred and 50 leads. So from that standpoint, I look at it and say, you know, there’s more fish in the ocean, but if I can find a barrel worth of fish, that’s where I’m going to go to every time. And so I think a lot of times people think bigger is better. No bigger, bigger is not always better, you know, uh, a small niche podcast that’s got your ideal. Our listeners could be great. Now somebody told me there’s a a sport now called pickle ball and I should probably look this up because I have no idea what it is, and they said it’s like an indoor tennis ping pong type thing.
I don’t know how will you would advertise pickleball, you know, which you would you get a, a, a superbowl ad to try to get all those people now, which you try to go on facebook. Well, he also told me that there are five podcasts devoted to pickle ball. I tell you what, if I had pickleball equipment or pickle ball course, I would pass the superbowl. I’d pass facebook ads. I tried to get on every one of those podcasts because even if they only have 100, 500 listeners, that’s 500 people that are passionate about what you have to say.
Yeah, yeah, no kidding. Um, I, I think it’s always interesting for me how people always want to go after the big fish or be on the big platform or whatever it is. When most of the time it’s so big that there just aren’t. Your message isn’t hitting the target. You know, the people who, it could be huge, but the people who you need are there, which sounds like some of what you went through and so when you’re focused and your targeted with your marketing on being where your audience is going to hear you, it’s, it’s worth that amount of time, that amount of effort, you know, whatever that thing is.
What’s it going to hurt somebody? And I wish I could remember who it was because it was a great quote. He said that context is king. Content is king, but context is God. So from this standpoint, uh, you could have great content, but if it’s got no context, to me it’s going to be worthless. You know? Um, I could, um, I could be talking about podcast interview marketing and it’s great content. Well, if I go to a podcast that is both focused on pickleball or new mothers, it’s got no context. So why would it be meaningful to them? So I think with that, you know, podcasting while marketing all over, it should be more of a rifle approach than a shotgun approach.
Yeah, I think so too. Which is another reason why when you’re looking for the podcast today and you want to make sure that that’s where your audience audiences, so talk to me about authors, um, and how they can use targeted podcast interview is really as a virtual book tour,
uh, this is, this is one of our favorite ones, Diane. Really, because you think about it, there’s great books out there, but how do you ever find out about them? And it’s usually just from somebody else suggesting it now referring and saying, this is a great book. Here’s what it’s about. You should check it out. Well, podcasts are perfect for that. And you know, in the old days, authors used to have to drive around from town to town doing virtual book tours. And we’ve even had some authors that used to do that and they’d say, you know, I would drive to the Barnes and noble so that I could talk with maybe 50 to 100 people. And that was a good book event. And they’re now. Now they said I could do a series of podcast interviews and I could do those from home. I could do them from on vacation, I could do them anywhere and I could reach thousands, tens of thousands of ideal people, and I could have a half hour to to talk about the book, why I wrote it, what it’s all about and really is it’s so much more powerful and such more leverage.
We’ve worked with authors from Morgan James Publishing, Simon and Schuster, Barnum business, a Harvard business review, all of this, and they used it as a great way to get out and let their book, Let people know about their book and also you could time the interviews if you plan far enough ahead and if you’re out of podcast, say you know, Diane, the book’s coming out on this date. Would you mind releasing this interview? I got a a week before or a week after, and if you give people enough heads up on that, most podcast hosts are thrilled to do that. And so think about it. If you’re releasing a book and a week before you’re on a dozen podcasts and a week after you’re on another dozen podcasts, you don’t think there’ll be a bump in your Amazon sales and your rankings. A, it’s really a great strategy, a great leverage strategy that you can use to really grow your Biz, your book sales.
Yeah, no kidding. Well, so along the same lines now what shift from authors, coaches and talk about how it benefit, you know, can help them. And I’m really thinking in terms of ideal clients, really being able to connect with their ideal client.
Sure. And coaches. It’s so great too because your personality really comes out, right? If you’re, if you’re selling coaching or any relationship service, it’s not a service or a product. It’s a relationship, right? They want to work with you. There could be 100 other coaches out there that do a similar thing, but really what they’re buying is your experience. They think they can work with you. Um, and I don’t think you’re going to be able to, uh, to get them to know you from maybe a blog or a definitely a facebook ad, you know, would you set down a good money for a relationship with a coach that you’d never really talked to, never heard about. And that’s why I think it’s so powerful for, uh, for coaches. And that’s, uh, our early success that we had was all with coaches because they got there.
They got to get in front of their ideal audience. They get to tell their stories. They get to tell what motivated them, what, what they enjoyed in life, who they worked with. They could tell a stories now they would always leave people’s name out, but they would tell stories of how people, how could they, could help people and how they’d helped people in the past. And you know, I would say most podcast listeners would listen to that and go, oh, that was very interesting. I’m glad I listened to that, but they wouldn’t take action. But you know what, there’s that portion that resonated with that and said, that is the coach for me. I can see how they could help me, I could see where my gap is right now, where, where I need this and for that it becomes so powerful there. And you think about, you know, if you ask most coaches, how do you get your, um, uh, your clients?
It’s usually from meeting people, from referrals, from speaking to people, and that’s what podcasting especially being a guest allows you to do. And now we’ve talked to some people and you know, I, I don’t say it’s either be a guest or have your own podcast. I think there’s a place for both and you can do both, but if you think about it, if you’ve got a, a, a podcast and somebody has listened to you for a couple of months and they haven’t become a customer, chances are they’re probably not going to become a customer, right? They’ve, they’ve heard it. If you want to go out and get new converts, if you will, you need to go out into new areas. And uh, Alex Harris for marketing optimization on a podcast interview that, uh, he had me on. He pointed that out. He said, you know, I can count the number of clients that I’ve gotten from my own podcast. Probably on one hand he says, where I get new clients is going out into other people’s podcasts and other other areas where I’m a fresh voice. I’m a new voice. People are introducing me to their audience. And so from a podcast or from a coach’s standpoint, I think it’s so powerful. That’s probably to be the most powerful media, but you could use to grow your business.
That’s an interesting way of thinking about it because really it’s like doing public speaking only. You have a broader audience. You’re able to talk to people and share and you’re getting in. You’re tapping into other people’s, um, listeners in other people’s tribes, but you know, the, the, the fandom that they’ve built around them. So, you know, one of the things that I think matters is if someone’s got a really good podcast, this, another reason why they have an obligation to their listeners, because when they bring a guest on, their listeners are saying, sort of that leaping the trust chasm that well, this person must be worth listening to or you know, Diane wouldn’t have them on
very much so. And you think about it, the host wants to make you sound. He wants to make the guest sound good, look good. So there’s that credibility that goes along with that. The other thing that you pointed out there is something that I said at a live speaking event that I did a couple months ago in lansing, Michigan. I was thrilled to get invited to speak to an inbound marketing group. I, you know, it was, it was great. I was glad to be there. But halfway through the presentation we’re having a good time. We’re talking and I had to stop and say, I can’t tell you the last time I spoke in front of this small of a group and I said, I’m thrilled to be here, but you know, it took me an hour and a half to drive here. I was fine. I’ll be here for a couple of hours.
I love that. And I’m going to drive home for another hour and a half. So I’ve probably got mad, I don’t know, six or seven hours invested into this and I, and I cherish every bit it, but I’m like any podcast I go on takes 30 to 60 minutes and I said I’m talking to hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands of people. So in the middle of this presentation I just, I sort of had to chuckle at that and I think that’s when the light went off on their, uh, from their standpoint too. It’s like, wow, this is, this is very, very powerful.
No kidding, no kidding. So you were aware. My old Alma Mater is Michigan State
and I’ve got to say that I’m from Kalamazoo, Michigan, which proves as long as you have an internet connection, you could do a podcast interview from any place.
Yes. It’s so true. That’s exactly right. So talk to me now about speakers who want to be able to get keynotes and paid keynotes, you know, invitations. So is there a way that they can use targeted podcast interviews?
Very much so. And I think all of my paid speaking engagements have come off a podcast interviews and I think the thing is, is that, is that try before you buy, right? If I’m going to book you as a paid speaker, what do I want to see from you before, um, before I actually signed you up? Well, maybe it’s seeing you speak at another event. Okay. That’d be one way to do it. Um, maybe it would be seeing the speaker reel, but maybe it’s just hearing somebody talk. You know, I had written a blog for hubspot that got picked up and got shared around, you know, a widely. And it wasn’t until about a year later, I was out of podcast and the hosted reddit and asked me about it and we just spent probably a half hour talking about this blog. Well, it was uh, uh, the CEO of a company out in California that heard this interaction.
Uh, he went back and he read the blog, but then he had heard me also and he said, I like the way this person talks. And it was entertaining, engaging. Maybe he didn’t know what I looked like at that point, but either way they said, hey, uh, you know, the promoter of the event said, would you like to come out here and speak to us in California in October? And do you know what the weather gets to be like in October? And the end of Michigan. So I said, most definitely can I stay till spring. But it’s a, it’s a great way for speakers to get out there and to, to get their message heard. Sort of that no, no, like, and trust. And also for people to try them out as a speaker before they actually, you know, by and sign them up as a speaker.
That’s great. Now, if there are podcasters who want to grow their platform, is there a way that they can do it by being interviewed on other podcasts?
Oh, very much so. And I have to give credit to cliff ravenscraft podcast answer man, that pointed out this obvious fact that I had overlooked. If you look at the data right now, it says somewhere between 20 and 30 percent of the US population listens to podcasts. Now granted they’re. They’re better educated. They’re, they’re higher income earners, all the rest of that. But if you wanted to reach them and you went to facebook, 70 to 80 percent of the people would have no idea what you were talking about, right? So if you wanted to grow your podcast, going to twitter or facebook or Instagram, 70 80 percent of the people will have no idea what a podcast is. But if you go on other people’s podcasts, I can guarantee you that 100 percent of the people listening know what a podcast is and listen to podcasts and the data says that the average podcast listener consume 10 hours of audio content a week. So if they’re listening like me that at one and a half times speed, that’s 15 hours of content. Even if they’ve got a favorite show that’s an hour a day, there’s still more content there. So it’s really not that you’re going onto somebody else’s podcast to steal their audience. No, it’s really. If they’ve got a similar audience, you could help them, they could help you. And that’s really how people find out about other podcasts
that that’s awesome. And that’s a theme throughout this that I heard was I’m really focusing on where you should be on who is actually you’re actually going to be able to connect with. Because that’s an interesting thought that if you go on other people’s podcasts, you are where people are already listening to podcasts so they already get it
right. So you don’t have to. You don’t have to convert them, you don’t have to tell them how to do a podcast, how to, how to download it, all the rest of that, because, you know, if anybody remembers the first podcast, she’ll listen to you weren’t quite sure how it all worked and after awhile you just got comfortable with it and I think more and more you can either spend a lot of time trying to convert people to podcasts or talk to the people that are always already on board. And some people, somebody asked me the other day, well, if podcasts are 20 or 30 percent, when do you think they’ll get to 100 percent? And I thought, I’m like never right, because television and radio right now is, it’s been around forever and it’s not at 100 percent. Newspapers aren’t at 100 percent different.
People learn in different ways. Um, and so with that, uh, you know, it’s bound to get a lot higher than that. Uh, but, uh, you know, if, if you’re naturally an audio audio messed that, that word, an audio producer, right? So for me, writing a blog is much tougher than speaking on a podcast. Well, I can speak easily on a podcast, but then even sometimes I will repurpose the content. So you take a great audio interview, transcribe it, and turn it into a blog content, you know, some people will take their, uh, their podcast interviews, they’ll put some still frames in it and they’ll make a video out of it. It just from that standpoint, a gift, the content of the people in the way they want and it’s so much easier to do that now, uh, and podcasting has made that easy.
Yeah. Boy, no kidding. It’s a strange new world that I really like and I’m so thrilled that we had this conversation because when people think about marketing and they think about digital, they’re thinking about the standard usual places today, you know, like the facebook and twitter and linkedin and they’re not necessarily thinking about how powerful podcasts are and that there are opportunities to be guests out there. So that’s why I wanted you to come on. And Sharon, I, I so appreciate all the information. Will you share with my listeners how they can get your book and how they can find you and everything you want them to know?
Diana, I would. I would love to and thank you so much for having me here. I’m, like I said, when we were talking about how to do podcast interview marketing, I showed you behind the curtain. Part of that progression is that I want to give all kinds of value here. So if you go back to interview valet.com, forward slash a why BG for accelerate your business growth. Everything that Diane and I talked about will be there. I’ll have the six tips to getting on your first podcasts. There’s a, a training video that explains podcast, interview marketing, and even the book podcast guests profits. If you want a free download of it, um, you can go there and download that if you want to buy it on Amazon or the audio, or excuse me, the kindle version or the hardback, there’ll be a link for that also. But just if there’s any way that we can help you, please let us know because I’d love to work with people that are inspiring thought leaders and introduce them to, you know, millions of ideal customers that they could, a cake they could serve for the betterment of all. And uh, so once again, just going to interview valet.com, forward slash a why BG, um, all that stuff will be there and I’ll put my social media in there and my email, uh, so that we can connect there also.
Fabulous. Thank you. Thank you so much. And I always like to thank the listeners because you guys are why we’re all here. So thanks for tuning in. And I’d also like to thank our sponsor audible.com. Get a free trial and a free audio book by going to audible trial.com/business growth. Please continue to prosper and be curious and you know, check out new things and until we meet again on another episode of accelerate your business growth. Good bye. And good day.