Podcast Interviews

Nice Guys on Business

February 23,2016 / Podcast / admin

Listen to the full interview here ( 33:06 minutes)

 

Full Transcript

Hey, it’s John Lee Dumas and you’re listening to the nicest guys in podcast land. Get ready as Doug sailor and Strickland Bonner, take your business to the next level. This is the nice guys on business podcast. Listen, here’s the thing, if you can spot the sucker in your first half hour at the table, then you are the nice guys on business.

Need an education on how to grow your business. The nice guys are here to help learn about great customer service, networking and how just being nice can help you prosper. Now, here are your hosts, Doug Sandler and strickland. Bonner. Hey, nice guy, community. Welcome back to the podcast. My name is Doug Sandler.

That guy right over there just sitting right next to me. His name is strickland. Bonner. What’s going on? Strickland over there. How you doing? Hey, so good to be back in the same virtual room with you, doug, and this is the nice guys on business podcast. If you are joining us for the first time, a huge, huge thank you for checking us out are a little old podcast. Drake, believe it or not, downloaded now in 97 countries, unless they’re getting tons of new listeners. We love you guys. We are around the world. We only speak English, so if you speak any other languages, I’m afraid you’re screwed. It’s so crazy to think that we, uh, I barely make it out of my house and we got, we got 97 countries that are, uh, that are listing. Well, you guys keep asking us for quality and hopefully in your humble opinion, we keep delivering the superstars that you have been asking.

So, uh, we have some really cool things. I mean, we have a whole bunch of cool stuff that’s coming up today on today’s show. We have a guy, his name is Tom Schwab and he’s more than just a guy. He’s a nice guy. He’s a busy guy. He is a successful guy. So, uh, thank you so much. Nice Guy, community for connecting with us on all the social channels for tweeting with us, for reviewing us, for listening, for podcasting, and for doing all sorts of fun stuff. And just listening to us. We really, really, so very much appreciated. So strict, why don’t you give us a little bit of description on, uh, on our guest today, Tom Schwab.

Well, this interview with Tom was great. I mean he is a business and life coach and you know, a little bit of a twist. I’m this guy, he is ex military. He graduated from the Naval Academy. He was actually a nuclear surface warfare officer. So this guy like had his finger on the nuke, on a navy aircraft carrier. I mean he’s had his finger on the button. Well yeah, like close to on the button. Yes. He’s a dangerous man to get on the wrong side of. But he was holding the briefcase, briefcase or something like that. Five website trust factors vitaled. Every podcast guests is his view from the top. You know what he recently wrote a blog called called I want fewer leads in 2016. So you got to listen to the podcast to hear more.

More about that. So today’s call to action. I know it’s not as important as our, as our guest today, but I definitely want to get you over to Doug Sandler.com. Take a few moments, sign up for my blog. We got you listened to the podcast. I want you a part of the full Nice Guy Community, which would be the, which would be the blog as well. And if you sign up today, you’ll be a bonus video just for signing up. The video will be immediately available for you to view. It’s the Nice Guy Thirty program and it is free and it is for you just for signing up to, uh, to read my blog today.

Love that. Love that. Hey, doug, guess what else? You know, how big we’re getting. We’re so big. We have a sponsor now.

I know, I know. This was great virtue. Elite virtual assistance they are saying is actually sponsored a spousal today, elite virtual assistant. They are Laura courtesy and the, uh, the crew over at elite virtual assistants. They are, um, they are virtual assistants. And I’ll tell you something, I’ve been too busy to do a lot of the stuff that I’m, I’m glad I’ve been too busy, but there’s still things that I have to do, like as in prospecting, I gave Laura a, um, a little bit of a, a, a homework assignment and it was to please help me by, um, by going out to the Internet and retrieving about 100 email addresses for prospective customers that I needed for my speaking business. And within about three days she got back, she probably could have done it immediately, but I didn’t need it. I gave her a week to do it. Within three days she got all this information back to me and, um, I’ve already got six prospecting calls as a result of what Laura has done. So elite virtual assistant.com. I use them personally. I got to tell you, I couldn’t be any happier. Have you? Have you ever used a virtual assistant? Strict.

I have on a number of occasions and I gotta tell you guys if you don’t think you need it, trust me. You do. If you’re too busy, it’s, it’s any little thing that you might need done like travel and event planning for trade shows, business trips, vacation seminars, research, all kinds of stuff. You know, what if you’re not sure, hey, what would you use a virtual assistant for? Go to elite virtual assistant.com and check it out and just get some ideas and like, hey, maybe I could try that. Maybe I could use some help with that. It’s just check it out. Okay. Well, uh, thanks for that and let’s get onto the interview. Okay, ladies and gentleman, welcome back to the podcast. Thank you guys for coming back and listening in today. We’ve got a great guest. His name is Tom Schwab. He is an accomplished author, blogger, speaker, business owner.

His work has been featured in Forbes, linkedin, hubspot, Eo fire, so many others. He’s also the CEO of view from the top, which offers business and life coaching services, but with a bit of a twist and we’re going to get into that a little bit later in the podcast, but first of all, hey tom, welcome to the show strictly. I am thrilled to be here and I guess I can call myself a nice guy now that I’ve been on the nice guys on business podcast, right? Absolutely. That’s what we’re all about. It’s, it’s all about sharing your experiences and what you’ve been through and the good things and the bad things to do and not do to try and help businesses and that is going to help our entrepreneur listeners out a lot. So Tom, you got a really interesting background. You graduated from the Naval Academy in Annapolis Right down the road from Baltimore, my hometown. You were a nuclear surface officer

on a Navy aircraft carrier. Then you’re going into medical device manufacturing and eventually into medical device sales. So that is definitely an interesting journey. Why don’t you tell us about how you got there? Well, first of all, thanks to everybody for paying for my education. I really appreciate it. I was a midwestern boy, grew up in the suburbs of Chicago, the farthest West I had been in my entire life was the Mississippi River, the farthest east was Indiana. And the navy gave me a great opportunity to see the world, to get an education and a, I’m an engineer by degree and I think that really impacted me on the way I saw life and the way I still see life. And when I went on the aircraft carrier, I was just amazed that you could take so many people from different areas of life and train them to do a job and do it with excellence.

You know, the scary thing is, is right now the average age of somebody running a nuclear power plant and the Navy is probably about 22 years old. That’s crazy. It’s crazy. And it’s a testament to them. I mean, these people are smart, they’re driven, they really work hard, but it’s also a testament to the systems that are put in place to allow them to have success. So I loved my time in the navy and then in about [inaudible] 92 for anybody as old as me, they’ll remember when peace broke out and the Russians didn’t play the game anymore. Uh, I’d done all the fun things that I wanted to do in the navy. And, uh, had the opportunity to go into the civilian world and had the, uh, uh, was fortunate enough to get a job with a fortune 500 company as an engineer. I’m in the medical device field and I loved that, but quickly realized I didn’t like being an engineer in engineer, uh, so I got more into the operations side and really with the leadership and, uh, the, the systems there, then went out into sales and marketing and uh, had great success with that.

And ultimately I looked at that and said, I want to do my own thing also. So I had the opportunity to have my own distributor ship, uh, in the state of Michigan and we were selling artificial joints, hips, knees, shoulders, that sort of thing to hospitals and doctor’s offices. And it was great. I, I really enjoyed the experience. But then when the economy turned here in Michigan, the manufacturers, they wanted to go direct. They wanted to cut out the middleman, which always makes a whole lot of sense until you look in the mirror and go, hey, I looked like the middleman. That can be a problem. So we looked at as an opportunity, we sold back the distributor ship and we had a sideline business that was really just helping people that couldn’t bear weight and couldn’t bear crutches. So I was called goodbye crutches.

And um, at that time it was just a small Michigan based company and we said, could we use the tools of the internet in order to grow this from a regional business and to a national business. And uh, at that time I had read a book by two smart guys out of Mit, uh, that talked about how the world was changing that the Internet allowed people not to be sold to. Nobody likes to be sold, but everybody goes on the Internet for help in learning to, in helping them buy. And their premise was that those people that helped people make a buying decision through content, things like blogs, videos, even the podcast we’re doing here, they would be seen as thought leaders. They would gain the lake and the trust of people and ultimately they would grow their business that way. And was a term called inbound marketing.

And we really ran with it. And within three years it took us from a regional player to a national leader and I was seen as a leader in that space. We were really the first ecommerce company to do that. And over the years I’ve helped other companies do it, uh, and really get their message out there, you know, at its heart marketing is just starting a conversation with somebody that can be an ideal customer and that’s, that’s how I love the marketing side of it. And that’s how I got involved with, uh, Aaron Walker and view from the top also. Well, Tom, it sounds like your, uh, your journey of discovery with sales is very interesting. You looking at it in the, uh, in the rear view mirror as you mentioned before. Um, it, it makes sense in that way. Like you just decided, hey, engineering’s not really for me, I’m really better at sales.

I really like it more. And it sounds like the way that you’ve gotten into it, you know, you just said something along the lines of, you know, people don’t like to be sold to, but they like to buy that. That’s like an old Jeffrey gitomer saying, I think it’s basically he, he kind of started that, but honing that to inbound marketing, it’s. It’s so perfect because for years we’ve been conditioned to push product down people’s throat. Right. But nobody likes that. It is about creating the conversation and in fact that ties into a recent blog that you wrote called I want fewer leads in 2016. Again, sales totally counterintuitive on the surface of it, but I think it ties into your whole. People don’t want to buy. They don’t want to be sold to, but they want to buy. Why don’t you go into a little detail on that?

Sure. It came out of a conversation. I was in a panel and one of the people up there said you needed 75 new leads every day, and I was the person that threw my hand up and said I couldn’t have. I couldn’t service 75 leads a day. I couldn’t serve as 75 new customers a day. And they came back and said, well, you know, it’s not, it’s not customers. It’s just people on your email list. And I said, I don’t want people on my email list that I can’t help, that I can’t be of service to, and we’re really focusing down there. And I think the, uh, Gary Vaynerchuk has that book out that calls, you know, a Jab, Jab, Jab, right hook, I might have missed a couple of jabs in that. I look at it from the way of serve, serve, serve, serve, ask, and that’s how marketing should be.

That’s how sales should be. And every one of those times you serve, you build trust, you build the authority there. And I’d rather have that with a smaller number of people that I could. I could turn into advocates than just names on a list. So playing devil’s advocate for a minute, let’s say, okay, you need 75 leads in. Your answer is, Hey, I can’t handle 75 leads. Well, Hey, that means your business is growing, right? Why don’t you just hire more people? What would be your answer to that one? Well, you could hire more people, but I would look at it as I couldn’t take 75 new customers a day. And every lead I have, I want it to be a high quality lead that could become a customer, not just some little name, their bond. I think that’s the answer right there. It’s, you know, it’s not just 75 people that are going to sign up for your list who are never going to open your emails, are never look at your content.

It is about getting the quality customer, the person you want to attract, the person that’s actually going to be able to use your service or your good. So Tom, I know that’s exactly what you do with view from the top is you help people not only attract customers but attract the right customers. Why don’t we go into a little detail on that? How do you do that? Yeah, we’ve really used, you know, the idea of talking directly to your ideal customer and you can do that any way you want to. You can, you know, do it through blogs, social media. One of the ways we found the best is being a podcast guest and talking directly to them. I’m not having your own podcast, but tapping into other people whose podcast they already listened to and there’s 186,000 podcasts, uh, right now in the US and there’s only, probably 100 or 200 that really have your ideal buyer on that and that’s what you need to focus on first.

You know, there may be more fish in the sea, but you want to fish in a barrel. You want to, you want a fish, right? Where your ideal customers are. So I would encourage anybody, whatever your business is, this should be the foundational step for it. Ask Yourself, who do I want to talk to? Who is my ideal customer? And we were worked with a client that he was selling a book and I asked them, who’s your ideal reader, who’s your ideal customer? And he joked and said, anybody with $20 that wants to buy a book? And I’m like, no, that’s not it. Because. Because ultimately you don’t want $20 from a purchase, right? You want to focus not on the transaction but the lifetime. So you want to talk, you want to focus on connecting with somebody that is going to be so thrilled that they’re going to go out and tell other people about it, that they’re going to be a lifetime customer, you know, we need advocates, not just customers, and that’s something the things that we’ve always done with view from the top is trying to engage, trying to give as much value, free value as possible to build that trust.

And you know, if somebody likes what, uh, what they see and wants to engage with us further, that’s great, but they don’t have to buy anything to get value add. There’s so many ways to micro market now with keywords and specific websites that you can mark it on and Google and facebook adwords and linkedin and everything else. But really that can get incredibly expensive and a lot of people are ignoring all the side ads where they have something like intently, which basically blocks any of the ads and that can get really expensive. So Tom, your strategy is really amazing. I mean, it’s the same type of thing. You’re basically saying, okay, let’s find a very specific niche market or a niche customer, but instead of trying to pump money into that, let’s find the right podcast, because these people, the podcasters presumably already have a listeners who are advocates and probably are looking.

If you find the right podcast, you find ones that are looking for the services that you offer. It’s really, it’s pretty brilliant and it’s, it’s a way of serving. Um, I was just talking with a client, uh, that we have that does, um, cybersecurity. He’s testified in front of Congress. He’s been on Fox News and he, he’s helping now, small businesses, um, put procedures in place so that you know, they don’t get scammed. And with that it’s like, well, there’s a great service now. You could spend a lot of money on ad words, facebook ads, all the rest of that to get that message out. Or You could just go out and talk about it, give people a lot of value and show yourself as that authority. One of the things I’m always amazed by is that people start chasing tactics, and I learned in the Navy that tactics when battles, but strategy wins the war.

And I’m always amazed when when people come out with their new tactics and every tactic has an expiration date on it. What worked, what worked 10 years ago is not gonna work today. And sometimes when people, uh, start telling you about their tactic, the what worked for them to build their business, you know, five years ago, I scratch my head and go, and that’s like strickland telling me what the shortest line at the, at the grocery store was yesterday. It’s very interesting. But how does that help me? And I even tell my clients this, when I built my business, uh, the ECOMMERCE business in 2008, we did it on blogs and at that time blogs worked really well. You know, now they’re saturated and you won’t get that same kind of results from it. So while the strategy is the same and how do you serve customers, how to relate to them, how to start that discussion with them, you’ve always got to be looking at what’s the newest tactic, what’s the newest tool that I can use to do that? Now the only constant is change and that’s one that, you know, a lot of people have a very hard time dealing with and it’s so true. And it sounds like you guys do a really great job of that. I’m

one of your titles is inbound engineer. Why don’t you explain to me exactly what the job of the inbound engineer is.

Hi, I’ve got an MBA in marketing, but I don’t consider myself a marketer. I’m, I consider myself an engineer at heart. I’m one of the things that frustrated me. So Strickland, when I got out into the civilian world and working in marketing and sales as hearing people say, yeah, 50 percent of the things we do, uh, they don’t work, but we just never know what 50 percent they are. Pull. I pull my hair out. I’m like, so 50 percent of the things you do aren’t helping the customer and they might really be ticking off the customer. Right? So I always look at things as an engineer and as a problem to be solved and I love digital marketing because of the feedback from it. You know, right now our experts are telling us exactly what to do. You know, you only have to be smart enough to do right answer when told and the experts is not the business owner.

It’s not the consultant, it’s not that article that you read last week on fortune or ink. The experts are your customers and everyday they’re telling you what they love and what they love. So when you send them an email and they share it and they open it, they just told you, I love this. When you send them one and it gets unsubscribes and spam reports, they just told you I load this, don’t do it again. And it’s the same thing on our website. It was talking to a client and he said, well, what pages should I highlight on my navigation? You know, when somebody comes to my website and I’m like, I’ve got my opinion, but the experts will tell you, just go and look and see what pages are the most visited people, spend the most time on, the experts have told you what they love. Just gave a more of that. And uh, so that’s one of the things that I love about marketing and uh, so that’s why I call myself more of an inbound engineer than an inbound marketer.

Oh, it’s so true. All of the numbers, all the figures are out there. They’re easy to find. You just got to know where to look for him and you got to pay attention. I mean, you, you can’t just ignore them. How many of you know, what pages are getting hit the most? And uh, you know, what emails are, are creating the most unsubscribes, those types of things. It’s so, so true. So, um, let’s get into your company, a little bit of view from the top. You guys take a little bit of a different approach. I’m obviously, there are a lot of business coaching companies out there that offer a one on one coaching, but I know a couple of the things that you guys do, you do have a lot of great free content on your website, which to me, I think, you know, the Nice guys on business we’re all about, we want to share what we’ve done to try and help other people out. You obviously do that right upfront with your website. Got a five website trust factors, vital to every podcast guests. Uh, you got a number of other really great free content pieces, but if you from the top, I noticed

you also not only all offer one on one coaching, but also mastermind group is built in and your private membership community. What else do you do different from just what we don’t want to say generic business consultant? Like it’s a like group everybody into a thing, but you know, there are a lot of them out there. It’s a, it’s a tough, it’s a competitive business, right? And view from the top. Really. We started by Aaron Walker and Aaron’s got 30 years of business experience and I think more than anything, it’s not just the business experience, it’s the life experience, you know, he’s figured out how to live a life of success and significance. He talks about the three pillars for your life, you know, being professional, personal and spiritual. And I think too many people talk about just one. And it doesn’t matter if you come home with lots of money to a household as strangers, you won’t be happy.

He won’t feel significant. Um, you won’t feel successful. So with that, you know, we try to bring people together, um, in order for us to all be better men. Uh, Aaron just focuses on his coaching on men and um, you know, through different things in free resources. So if you just go there, you know, there’s different checklists that you can do if you want to be part of an online community. That’s a level, if you want to be part of masterminds and a really big into masterminds. I love that concept of that together we’re smarter than we are individually. I’m one of the things I learned, like I mentioned that I was a midwestern kid growing up and my dad moved out to Chicago as soon as he could to get us out there and we got this postage stamp lot and I think he put a for fruit trees up there and there was an apple tree, a cherry tree, a peach tree, and a plum tree.

And after about two years there was no fruit on it and he was about ready to chop them down. He was mad as anything. I wanted them to chop down so we could play baseball in the backyard. But finally the neighbor came over and he was a farmer that had moved into the suburbs and he scratched his head and he says, you’ll never get any fruit outta here. You’ve got to have other trees like this. You know, you’ve got to cross pollinate. My Dad had no idea what he was talking about, but our next door neighbor was nice enough that he got similar trees and the next year we both had fruit. And I think it’s so true in our lives to that we’ve got to be exposed to new ideas, new ways of doing things that cross pollination between industries and it doesn’t happen naturally. We’ve got to intentionally do that.

And now with the Internet and connecting with different people, it’s easier than ever to do that. And I think in our lives too, if you don’t expose yourself to new ideas, if you don’t cross pollinate, you’re not going to see the fruit in your life that you could. You know, there’s a great story that I heard about the president of td bank and he was one of the first guys that had bank branches open on Saturday and had late hours. And when he started doing this, he went to a convention of a bank, ceos and everybody was asking, oh my gosh, how do you do it? How do you get people to work on Saturdays and work on the evenings? And, and he said, Walmart’s been doing it for years. And then that’s it. We get so stuck in our own business that we can’t see outside of that box sometimes.

And getting help from other people and why I think not only the personal experience, um, from everybody there, I’m sure you’ve got a number of guys that view from the top, but the mastermind groups I think are incredibly important because there’s so many times where there may be a problem in your company or your industry and you just can’t see the answer and a completely different industry may be looking at that same problem from a different perspective and may have a great answer for it. So there’s a, one of my favorite quotes comes from a gentleman by the name of Derek Sivers. Derrick started cd baby, which was the precursor to itunes and he wrote a book called anything you want, um, and in there he talks about what’s ordinary to you is amazing to others. And it’s so true. We, we all think that what we know everybody else knows.

And it’s not until you start talking with other people that you find out just bits of pearls of information that they’ll just throw out that they thought everybody knew that. All right. So tell me, you made an interesting comment that you only work with men. Why is that? Well, Aaron Walker only works with Ben and his coaching in view from the top and it’s just a where he feels most comfortable with and the community that view from the top. Um, it’s just set up that way. And um, so that’s always how we’ve done it in my personal business. I’m helping people with podcasts. I work with men and women. It’s just, I think whatever your Avatar, your ideal customer a that you think you can serve best, I think that there’s a lot of benefit in niching down and I’m focusing on a smaller and smaller audience that you can really serve.

That was very interesting. And um, yeah, I agree 100 percent. I think a play to your strengths and if Erin feels that he works better with men. Um, we spoke with, I apologize, I can’t remember who it was a couple of weeks ago who does business coaching and he actually prefers to work with women. He feels that, you know, women can, can learn better, more openminded, but obviously that just suits his style of teaching better where Erin feels the teaching men suits his style better and I totally agree with that. You really, you need to play to your strengths. So one to ask you, I strongly believe that the problems that we have over the years in business are the things that really make us stronger. It’s our failures that really can do this better. And I know that recently you had a problem on a um, podcasts on the big wig nation podcast and you were nice enough to put it on your website and talk about like some people you have a problem and it’s like, okay, I never want to talk about that again.

But really you realize that you needed to learn from it. So not to embarrass you a bit, but I, it’s all about learning. I’d love to have you tell our listeners about that. Well, the only bad mistake is the bad mistake that you make twice. Um, you should never make it more than once. And one of the things I learned in nuclear power is mistakes will happen, but make sure everybody knows about the mistakes so that nobody makes it again. And the story goes that I was on a Darren Bentley’s podcast, super nice guy. He has a podcast called big wig nation. And I had restarted my computer. I had gone through my entire checklist of the things that I go through to make sure that, you know, I sound great, that everything is set and got on there. And I got on the podcast. I thought everything went well.

And toward the end, uh, Darren just said, I, I didn’t sound really good and I’m thinking, well, I’m, I’m speaking into a $300 microphone and it’s got to be great. It was only after the interview was over that I realized that when I rebooted my computer, my computer didn’t pick up my microphone. It picked up the built in microphone. So this entire interview I, I sounded like I was calling in from a bathroom stall and it just sounded awful. And Darren, bless his heart, he did a lot to clean up the, um, the audio, but I was still embarrassed by it. And so with that, it’s like humans are fallible, we all make mistakes and that’s why, you know, nuclear power has checklists and procedures they go through. That’s why a pilot that has been flying for 30 years still goes through the checklist every time.

And that’s something we’ve done and talk about masterminding and community. Um, the checklist that I put out on how to be a great podcast guest that comes from my experience, but it also probably comes from 50 other people that I’ve worked with that said, hey, I had this problem or hand this idea, um, we should always do this and we just keep adding it to the list. I mean, we were talking about one before we went on here that uh, um, somebody had it where they were going on a podcast interview. Things were going great and then their virtual assistant shared a video file with them on dropbox and all of a sudden it started to sink with it and there went all their bandwidth. So just those little things to always remember beforehand, and so we try to work with people so that, um, uh, their learning curve is a whole lot shorter and you talk about systems as well, you know, a lot of our listeners are entrepreneurs or wantrepreneurs and kind of starting businesses out and you got to realize that if you don’t come up with a system for doing things that all the things that you’re doing yourself, you’re always going to have to do yourself and you really need to figure out how you can set your business up so that you can pass those responsibilities onto someone else down the road and move onto bigger and better things.

And systems are, are the only way to do that. And from the standpoint of learning, um, we always learn from everything we do. Every podcast interview we do, we learned from it. We moved that into the next one. We’ll look at all the, the analytics, um, what, what worked, what didn’t work. Um, so that we can always get better with this because we’ve got this online sales and marketing engine is what I look at at and it needs to be fueled by content and that content can be, you know, podcast interviews, it could be your own podcast, it could be blogs, videos, whatever it is, but you should always be looking at that to tune up the engine so you get better and better performance out of it. And uh, so not only that you can make more money out of the back end of it, but also that you’re serving your customers a lot better.

Well, in time you say, you know, you said we learn from it, but that’s really the important thing is that all of the pieces that you need to learn from it are out there. But we need to actually look at it and go and analyze it afterwards and have and say, okay, well what went well, what didn’t go well and can I learn from it? And not everybody does that. So, you know, we, we shouldn’t assume that we need to learn from it, but not everybody does. Well, I’ll speak for myself when I’m smart. I’ll learn the first time I make the mistake. Uh, sometimes, uh, if it’s more painful, uh, I have to make the mistake more than once, uh, that, that is it. Exactly. I think we are all in that boat, so we’re running out of time here, but I want to do to let everybody know the, the website, which of course is going to be in the show notes as well.

T M Schwab Dot Com. It’s t, m, s, c h w a, B.com, all kinds of free content, a 48 low cost ways to convert visitors into customers on your site. A, lots of other great information about how you can hear a, you can sign up for, for services with a view from the top. Um, Tom, why don’t you give us a little wrap up. Anything else that you didn’t get a chance to mention about a view from the top? Yeah, strickland. In fact, I’ll make a special page just for the listeners here. That way if you go to the website, uh, the day this podcast airs, or if it’s two years from now, you’ll get the same information. So if you go to tm, Schwab Dot com, forward slash nice guys, it will be everything that strickland and I talked about here, all the, anything that I referenced, all the offers there and I love to connect with people.

Um, I think twitter is a great platform. I’m sorry, I’m twitter’s great. But linkedin also, uh, so I honestly believe what’s, you know, what’s ordinary to one person is amazing to another. So I love to connect with people. I’m the only time, Schwab and all of Kalamazoo a. So if you’re interested in any of the things here, have any questions, want to reach out to me, please feel free to do so on Linkedin also. Excellent. Tom, thank you so much. Can set up a personal page just for nice guys. Listeners, I mean, I don’t think. I can’t think of anything else that would be nicer than that. Tom Schwab is definitely, truly one of the nice guys. Once again, ladies and gentlemen, thank you so much for listening. All the nodes will be on the, um, excuse me on the podcast notes page of course, but once again, the website, Tom Schwab, it’s t, m, c h, W

A, B dot Com backslash. Nice guys, and you can hear about everything we talked about on the podcast today. Ladies, gentlemen, thanks for listening and don’t underestimate the power of Nice. We’ll see you next time. Interviews every Tuesday and Friday. Fill up your week with the Nice guys two interviews a week. Haven’t they run out of people willing to talk to them yet?