Listen to the full interview here ( 36:37 minutes)

Full Transcript

Welcome to roads to success. This is the podcast for content and relationship marketers. Jessica Rhodes is the founder of interview, not premier source for booking outstanding podcast guests. She’s a wife, work at home, mom and rock star entrepreneur. I’m ready. I Know Jessica is ready. The only question left is are you ready to travel the road?

He’s discovered a marketing strategy that converts traffic into leads at a rate of 30 percent, and in today’s show you’re going to get all of his secrets. I am your host, Jessica Rhodes, and if you like what you hear, you can catch us every week by subscribing on itunes or stitcher radio. On the show today is another returning guests to two roads to success. In our last conversation, we talked about inbound marketing and since then he has been tearing it up with a marketing strategy that he’s discovered, takes his traffic and converts it to leads at a rate of 30 percent. And just to give you some perspective, typically a good blog that converts at one to two percent. So to hear more of his story and tips around inbound marketing. I want you to, after this episode, go back and listen to his first interview with slash Tom, but stay tuned right now because the information you’ll hear today is nothing that you want to miss.

So Tom Schwab, welcome back to roads to success. Thanks for joining me again today. Jessica. I’m thrilled to be here. I’m so excited to have you. So Tom is one of our titanium members at interview connections. He is a podcast guest expert and what brings me so much joy is that he’s been telling me that by getting interviewed on podcast, he’s really been seeing so much growth in traffic to his website and converting it to leads and also some of his clients are getting interviewed. We’re working with some of them as well and so I really wanted to bring him on the show to talk about his experience getting interviewed and give you all of his secrets and tips and tricks on how he’s taking these interviews as a podcast guest and showing results in his business. So Tom, I want you to start out by sharing what made you first decide to invest both your time and invest in our services to getting booked as a podcast guest.

Well, you know, if you look at it, content is what drives the modern marketing engine on line. You are what you publish. And for me writing blogs is tough and even for our clients to sit down and write a blog is tough. And then to tell them that it’s going to take you six to nine months to get traffic with a blog and just keep working at it. And we looked at it and said there’s gotta be an easier way to connect to people because with any content, what you’re trying to do is get them to know, like, and trust you. And I’d heard all the great things that people were doing with podcasts, but I looked at it and said, you know, it’s not easy to do a podcast. You’ve got the cost. Do it. And just to do what? Well, it’s going to take you that six to nine months to build up the traffic.

So we looked at it and said, well, could we use being a guest on podcasts of existing podcasts? And so we started to do a test on this a little over six months ago, and I was just blown away at the power of this medium. I think what’s great about it as you can really target a niche to get the kind of ideal customers you want, you know, so you’re talking to the right people, uh, they get 30 minutes to an hour to hear you and they either love you and go to your site to learn more, or they or they just, you know, listened to the next podcast. But the quality and quantity of context that we’ve gotten that come from listeners to visitors has been amazing. And then what’s even more amazing is when they come to the site looking for something, you know, the offer that you made on the podcast, they’re converting anywhere from 25 to 50 percent, which is just ridiculous in the Internet marketing world. So really, it’s not so much about the podcast itself or the interview. Uh, what we’ve tweaked with it and said is that really needs to be a system so that you find the right podcast so that you give a clear message, a clear offer that drives them back to your website and then that you set up the, uh, the system so that you can take them from a listener to a visitor to a lead to a customer and ultimately to an advocate that’s driving you more customers.

Let’s talk about that system because that is one of the things that we’re always recommending to our clients and we’re being more intentional about, you know, when we start working with someone, we’re really encouraging them and really being intentional about saying you’ve got to have a clear offer. There has to be a reason that they want to go to your website. So talk about the process of getting a listener to go to your website. So in your inner, you know, when you’re being interviewed, what do you have to be thinking about and saying and doing to actually get someone to want to go to your website?

I’ll give you a prime example here. You know, there’s only so much that you can communicate in the written word and if people want to find more about it, you’ve got to give them the opportunity to do that. So like for an example here, we’ve got an infographic that goes through all of the steps. It’s easier to visualize than trying to listen to the whole podcast. So, you know, I will say right now, if somebody goes to Tom, forward slash rts for rose to success, that’s where they get the infographic. So what you’re doing is trying to give something that gives them value, makes um, makes it easier to comprehend or learn more what you were talking about it. So what you want is something that is directly tied to what you’re talking about. Something that gives the listener a value. And that also has to them too often people, people try giving ’em a prize or a say like a, well, if you come to my site and sign up for my newsletter, you’ll be registered to win a ipad. Well, you don’t get ideal customers or unless your ideal customers are people that want a free ipad. So the value that you can give to them by continuing the conversation with them is what draws them back to your site.

Yeah, that, that makes total sense. Now what I’ve also seen is that sometimes you’ll have a good offer, but then the website isn’t set up in a way that, that easily converts. So what should a good landing page look like? So again, people are going to go to Tom, t s right slash rts, correct. Okay. And then they’re going to get this infographic. Now when they get to that page or you know, when they get to a landing page that’s set up, well, how should it be set up in a way that’s easily going to convert people onto their list?

Sure. And this is a great question, a great example because you just don’t want to send them to your website because I could’ve been on another podcast talking about another offer and you don’t want to confuse people when they come to your homepage. You have a right where you want to go, so when you get there, you want to reassure them that, hey, you’re in the right place. So go ahead and show the, uh, the picture or the little icon there from the, from the podcast that they were listening to. So instantly you’ve got that visual credibility of, oh, that’s right. I heard him talking to Jessica on Rhodes to success. So that’s there. Thank them for being there. Reminder what you were talking about in the, um, in the podcast, and then at the bottom, go ahead and put those offers down there. Now there’s the big question of, well, do you put the offer in front of a, um, uh, a form or behind a form?

And I’ve tested it both ways and I’m trying to focus on getting ideal customers, not just growing an email list. I think too often we just say, well, every email or every contact is worth it. No, not everyone. So what I, what I’ve been doing is, uh, if you go there, you’ll see the offers and you can go ahead and click those and get them right away. There’s no no there, no opt in to get those, but just below that there’s another option that says, hey, if you would like to get this, if you would like to get more information, I’m just go ahead and fill this out. I find that I get just as many opt ins from the people that sign up below that I do. I’m forcing them to give it to me before they see this info graphic. And so really what you want to do is, you know, content is king, but context is God. So bring them there, give them the content with the context you talked about. Don’t, don’t show them two dozen other things that are going to confuse them. Just go ahead and help them move along from what they heard to the offer.

I love that. That is, that’s great information because honestly I would have thought just, you know, have them opt in, but yeah, you’re right. I mean you give them and it’s great to hear that you’ve tested this so we know that this works. Okay, cool. So this is a big question that we get in a question that was actually just asked recently to me by one of our clients. So you talked a little bit about, you know, how much time it takes when you have your own podcast, how much time it takes, when you have your, you have a blog, I want you to talk about how long does it take before you start seeing results. And so we had a client of mine asked me, you know, I’ve been with you guys, uh, you know, about four months. I think she’s done probably about eight interviews and it’s just like, I’m just not seeing, you know, the traffic go up. So I want you to talk about how long does it take, what can, what could she be doing too you to increase the traffic? Or is it, is it about traffic or is it about leads? I talk a little bit about, you know, seeing results because we all want results right away, right? We want to see at work, we want to do an interview and see our website just boom with more traffic in our list skyrocket. But it doesn’t always work like that. So help us out here. Dumb. Right? Right.

I think it’s really what success looks like to you. Do you just want to get hurt by, you know, hundreds of thousands of people. Well, you can do that, but that’s not a business success. So really look at it and say, well, what do you want from this? What are you measuring? Are you measuring the number of listeners that, that, uh, here you, that that’s probably a hard one to, to monetize. So you’re looking at the number of visitors to come to your site. Well, they’re not going to come to your site unless you offer them something special. Are you looking at the number of contacts that, you know, you get the emails or you’re looking what percentage of those convert to customers? So really, I would look at all of those metrics that some calm down, you know, most people call it a sales funnel.

I look at it as a buyer’s funnel, you know, how am I helping people solve their problem is they come through here. So I would measure all of those. And really, you should be able to figure out where the leaks in the system are. So if you’re getting heard on a lot of good podcast with a lot of good target listeners and they’re not coming to your site, well there’s a reason for that because they don’t find any value for comedy or site. So there might be that your offer is weak if, if they’re coming to your site but not opting in, it could be that the landing page is confusing to them that it’s not clear. And then if you find that, um, you know, okay, they, they hear me, they come to my site, they opt in, but they’re not becoming a customer.

Then I would say you’ve got a problem in the nurturing sis ses sequence there. You know, what are you doing when they, when they come to your website, the first thing you should, should be doing is building that relationship, adding trust, giving them little wins. Not Saying, hey, buy this product, buy this service. Um, so with that, you know, if you’ve got lots of bleeds but not lots of customers, then look at it and say, what am I doing to nurture this? And one of the great ways to do it is to work back. So say you do get a couple of customers out of it, will follow them through and say, how did these customers get to me and what can I do to help more people come there? What offers did they bite on? What emails engaged them? And the wonderful thing I love about digital marketing right now is that the experts are always telling you what works and the experts, not me, the expert is not you as the owner of a business to experts, the customer, they’re the only ones whose opinion matters. And every day they’re voting with their dollars and their actions. So with that, you can see what, what emails engaged the best, what topics engaged at get best. We’ll start doubling down on those and the ones that engage the least, we’ll stop doing those. So with this, you should continually be getting better and better results. And that’s what we’re seeing with the clients that we’re working with, that um, uh, that we’re making. We’re getting more visitors, leads and customers as time goes on with the, with the podcast guest process.

Oh, that’s great. So just to go back, that was like gold right there in the last few minutes. So first of all, you want to make sure that you’re looking at. And there are a lot of different metrics. It’s not just about how much traffic is going to your site. And this reminded me of a good friend of mine who I mastermind with you as a guest on the show. Way Back when it started. Adam Homie, I’m so you can probably find his interview, rts And what Adam talks about, his business is called help. My website sells. So this is all right in line. Now he’s an expert in web conversions and he always says, I don’t like traffic. I don’t want a lot of traffic. Because know we think of traffic. We’re sitting in, sitting on the highway, not going anywhere. There’s too much. You don’t want a lot of traffic, you want the right traffic, you want the best possible ideal target clients, target customers to be going to your website. So you know, if you’re interviewed on a podcast and it’s, you’re absolutely ideal target, maybe there’s not a spike in 100 new people, go onto your website, but if it’s five people going to your website from that podcast, who are your ideal clients? That is really good, right? I mean, would you agree with that time? It’s about getting the right people. They’re not necessarily seeing a huge spike in traffic.

Very much so. Like, do you want a huge spike in traffic? Become infamous for a day, you know, the person that just gets accused of a crime or makes the headlines of the news. Everybody’s googling their name and their trending, but that’s, that’s not good traffic, which you want is not but quality because you don’t need 7 billion people coming to your website. You probably need, you know, if you had 70 ideal customers coming to your website each day, uh, you, you’d have more than you know what to do with.

Right? Exactly. Exactly, so yeah, it’s definitely about, you know, knowing what kind of metrics you’re looking for. So you started out by saying, okay, do you just want to be heard on really big podcast by a lot of different people? Well that, okay, that’s one metric to look at. Might not be the best if you’re trying to get very targeted leads to your website because you’re, you’re getting in front of so many people, they can’t possibly all be your ideal clients. So then okay, you then you’re looking at, you know, traffic do you just want a lot of traffic and you know, we just kind of talked about why you might not necessarily just want to be looking at your web traffic because that may not know a lot of people go into your website may not be actually be a good thing if they’re not all your ideal clients.

And then you also want to look at converting people onto your list. So how many, how many people are actually converting onto your list and are they your ideal clients, your ideal target market? What I think I want to ask you, Tom, I’ve heard quote unquote experts say different things and so I personally have people put in their first name and their email because I like personalizing the emails. I like being able to say hi, you know, tom and you know, we all know with email systems that’s kind of automated, you know, putting in someone’s first name, but what are your thoughts on that in terms of getting a someone’s first name so that way an email to them actually has their name in it when you’re broadcasting and email,

you know, I always answer every question with you should test that is what works with what audience may not work with another audience. I’m, I want to get as much information as I need. So I always, you know, ask for the name, I ask for the email for that reason and I never asked first name or last name. Most people give you both and then you can manually go ahead and do that. I don’t want to put the burden on them. Right? The other thing is that if you really want to funnel down and segment your customers from the very beginning, you may want to ask open ended questions are optional questions. Um, we did a study with one of our clients and just put an optional open ended question right there, and it was what is your biggest frustration about, um, and then whatever their product or service that they were selling.

And it was amazing putting that extra question in, did not lower the rate that people signed up for it. And 80 percent of the people filled that out. Now, if you’re trying to sell your services and somebody just told you what their biggest objection is, that is gold. You know exactly how to nurture them, what, what funnels to put them into to help address their problem. And really that really builds the engagement. And looking at the metrics you were talking about, you know, the right kind of customers. One of the things that I like sending traffic to a dedicated landing page, you know, like a slash rts. I can go back now over the last six months and I can tell you what, what podcast drove traffic and good leads and customers so I can start looking at that and saying what sources are my best sources? Can I go back to those hosts and tried to get on their show again, find other ones like that because I’m not saying that other podcasts are bad, but there were some great podcasts out there that didn’t convert for, um, for us or for our clients. So it’s important to know and say, why is that, um, you know, how can we make sure that we don’t go on that type of podcast, but we go on other ones. Once again, it’s always that learning,

right? Yeah. It’s the testing. It’s really an I, I love that you do the unique landing pages because I know that I know we have clients that are there, you know, they’re making the offers are giving away a free copy of their, of their book or something general. But again, if it goes to just, you know, your website, it might not be. Yeah. It might be confusing to the listener, so I, I love the idea of having a specific landing page and then making sure your offer is specific to what you talked about in that interview. So it’s a little bit more work on the back end, but you know, as we know, building a business does take some work. So creating a specific giveaway for what you talked about. I remember when I interviewed Aaron Walker, he had, um, and it was like probably a couple months ago, so I’m drawing a blank on what we talked about how your business is not your identity.

And he had um, I think he gave away a checklist and you know, it was very specific to the information that he shared in that interview. Um, so if somebody is listening like, oh, I, I want to get that. I mean, you could have just said, oh, you know, here, like go to my website and on the sidebar putting your name and email and you’ll get, you’ll get my free ebook. But that might’ve been a little bit general compared to what we just talked about. So I think it’s also taken me information you talked about in an interview and then bringing them more specific detailed information into, you know, that’s at your website rather than going more general

and it sounds people will say, well that’s a lot of work, it is extra work, but you want to make sure that that 30 minutes of your content, you’re getting the most out of it and, and all of these things you can go ahead and start outsourcing to to assistants or virtual assistants that that landing page, 95 percent of it is the same from one to the other. Right. So you’re going ahead and duplicating that time. I’m changing Jessica’s picture to somebody else’s. Changing the names at a couple little things in there, but most of them it’s about the same. Yeah. And that’s one of the things that we’re teaching in the course. We’re putting together. Somebody said this all sounds great, but I want to find out how I can leverage and have my assistant or freelancers do this. And we’re like, that’s a great idea.

So not only doing that, but then taking the content afterwards and saying, okay, how can you pull out some good tweets out of that and put it in a canva or something, uh, to put it out there on social media so that you drive people back to it. Can you take that transcript, you know, you just talked about for 30 minutes, can you take that, uh, interview, get it transcribed and you’ve probably got four or five blog posts right in there that’s not something that you have to do a, an assistant could do for you with that and really repurpose all the content to, to get the maximum out of it.

Another thing that I like to do is just consistently be sharing and promoting the podcast and, and not. I mean definitely posting it, you know, facebook, twitter, um, you know, sharing with your community, hey, I was on this show, but keeping it in mind as a resource. You know, I was interviewed on the coach Zing podcasts. It just went live recently. And we talked, I talked with Doug about really about similar type of information, how to get booked as a guest expert and a now I’m, when I see in a podcast facebook group, people are, I’m sure you see a Tom. People are really asking how do I get booked as a guest? I want to be on podcasts, I want to be a guest expert, how do I do it? And so instead of just saying, oh, come look at my stuff, I say, Hey, I was actually interviewed on this podcast where I talked about this, why don’t you take a listen?

And so from there it’s not really as self promotional because I’m pointing them to somebody else’s platform, putting them on somebody else’s podcast, but they’re getting information from me. So that’s really cool thing. So if people, you know, for whatever you’re interviewed on, if you see somebody asking about that topic, point them to a podcast where you were the guest. So I liked that because it, you know, again, it’s pointing them to somebody else’s content and it’s demonstrating not only you have the information but it’s showing, hey, I was a guest on this so I’m clearly know what I’m talking about.

And the, the other thing is that keeping that relationship going with that, that podcast or who talk about that, that is so vital. Okay, you’ve just, we’ve just talked for 30 minutes, you know, built a relationship. Are you just going to go away from there? You know, that’s, that’s insulting at that point. So go ahead and there’s little things you can do. You can thank them afterwards. You definitely want to promote the show because you’re promoting yourself and too many people will go ahead and you know, the day that it comes out, they’ll promote it and then they’re onto the next thing. Right? Well, the technology allows us to to leverage ourselves and amplify ourselves so much that you know, what I have my assistants do is they’ll go ahead and that day that podcast comes out there, not only scheduling the posts for today and tomorrow and next week, they’ll start scheduling posts out at least every once a month, maybe a couple times a month for the next year, and we always put the podcast host twitter name in it or their Hashtag or whatever it is, and so I know that they’re listening for their own name, so every couple of weeks, boom.

You know, Tom Schwab’s name comes back up. Tom Schwab, I’m all that keeps coming up so it allows me to stay top of mind with them.

Absolutely. Tom, I actually have a couple of guests that do that, you know, I know that they’re scheduling it out because it’s, you know, I just see it keep coming up. I’m like, that is awesome. They were on my podcast and they continually tweet about the episode because I’m always tagged in it, so I am not going to forget about that person because they’re continually sharing. And promoting their, their time on Rhodes to success

and that’s, it’s so powerful because if you remember them, they’ll remember you. And if you’ve got a podcast that worked really well for you, that you know from your analytics what page they came back to, well you’ve got the opportunity to, to reach back out to them. Or the other thing is that if some day down the line you start doing a cross promotion or an affiliate, I’m a affiliate marketing with them. You know, that their audience likes you. So that would be the first place to go to find more customers.

Right. And you know, we discovered this with my, my dad, my client, Jim Palmer, you know, I’ve been bugging him for years and when he just, he just released his sixth book, decide the ultimate success trigger and he did a big book launch for it and we booked them, you know, probably 20 times on podcasts and the majority of the podcast that we booked him on for this launch where people that have interviewed him over the past couple of years. This was a part two interview. And as you can see, you know, at this time, this is your second interview on Rhodes to success and the first one, it was more, um, you know, probably more surface level way park, talked about your background a little bit and we talked about goodbye crutches, we talked about marketing and now we’re diving a lot deeper into one marketing strategy that you’re seeing a lot of success with.

We’re going to talk about a course that you have. So by getting interviewed a second time, you have a deeper relationship with that host. They’re way more likely to want to promote you and promote what you’re doing because you’ve already established a rapport with them. So that first interview you do is really just the beginning of a long term relationship with that person that can bear future bear fruit for years to come. I made us, I, um, you know, my company, we also do some graphics and infographics. I was interviewed on Jason’s Silvermans podcast probably about two years ago when I was still doing pinterest work. And I’m telling you, a person found that interview because podcasts are evergreen. People are going to find them on Itunes, you know, years, months into the future. Somebody found the interview, sent me an email through my website and purchased an infographic.

I mean, yeah, I mean, I know people don’t want to wait two years before this, before this converts and it will happen faster than that, but it just goes to show you that this is something that you want to, you know, keep, stay committed to. Right? Like with a facebook ad campaign, you’ll run a facebook ad campaign, get people to a webinar and kind of do it really, you know, in a condensed period of time. But I mean, my thoughts with podcast interviews, it is a, it’s a longterm strategy that you want to consistently do and you don’t just want to do it a little bit and then give up on it. Right?

Very much so. It’s a compounding effect and the thing that we’re all trying to get his attention. So now you can either earn attention or you can buy attention and you can, you can buy attention in a facebook ad. It’s like crack. You get a hit and the next day it’s gone and if you can be your business can become addicted to it and the thing is, is you’re going to have to spend a little bit more, take a little bit more each day to grow your business. That’s not healthy, that’s chasing the transaction. Go ahead and invest in the content. Um, you might not get that big, big hit that first day, but you know what? Every day, every new podcast to do, every new piece of content is building on itself. And it’s like that old thing. We try to teach our kids with compounding interest, you know, if we would only started saving money when we were two years old and not spending it, we’d be retired by now. But it’s the same thing with content, you know, the best time to have done it was two years ago. The second best time is today and just keep going with it.

Yeah. Okay. So cool. This was, this was so helpful and I’m so excited to share this interview with our, with our clients and just with so many people who want to not only get booked, you know, I talk a lot about how to get on interviews, but then you get on and you’re like, okay, well where are the results for all my new clients? Right? And so this is interview is just so much great information. So again, just, you know, a couple of really important takeaways I want to make sure we all remember is, you know, what metrics are you testing, are you looking at traffic, which may or may not be a good metric to determine if the podcast is successful, how many optins you’re getting, how many people are starting to, you know, convert into, into leads and traffic. Tom, take, take it over from there, refresh my memory on all the different metrics they can look at and if you could just recap some of the different ways you know, some, some takeaways around the types of options they give away and how to make an offer. I’ll talk about that too as we’re wrapping up here. What’s the appropriate way to make an offer in a podcast?

It shouldn’t be just at the end, you should be talking about it. It shouldn’t be like you’re making a pitch at the end, so reference it during it, but also remind people at the, at the end of where it is, what it is. I’m always give them a, probably at least two so that there’s two things that they can go there for. You don’t want to give them a half dozen, but, uh, uh, make it clear. Talk about it during a couple times during this. And I know this is a prime example. So we’ve talked about the infographic a few times here. I mentioned the course, you mentioned the course. Guess what two offers that are going to be at the end, the Free Info graphic and the 25 percent off coupon on the course so that it’s not a surprise or it doesn’t feel like a sale or a pitch at the end when you wrap up with it that way.

Yeah, and as you’ve mentioned, people will be able to go do tm, and get that infographic and as Tom said, you know, there’s not gonna be, it’s not behind a wall. There will be an opportunity to put your name and email and for more information from Tom and I would encourage everyone to do that because I loved the information he’s giving and I wish I could stay on the call with him for another half hour and keep diving deeper into the sales funnels and the marketing strategies and everything because there’s so much more to talk about. But for now, [inaudible] dot com slash rts is where you’re going to get that infographic and talk a little bit about what’s this course, Tom? Tell us about it.

Yeah. You’ve mentioned a couple of our clients that we’ve been working with, uh, in this, in this interview, and we’ve taken everything that we’ve learned from them and solidified it down and say what are the six steps that we go from being getting people to be a visitor to a, actually a listener, to a visitor, to a prospect, to a customer then to an advocate. So we’ve put it together and the six step system and it’s got six videos in it, over an hour’s worth of training. It’s got all the checklists we use, the workflows, we use sample email, sample landing pages. Um, the whole idea is to get things, everything there that you need to build the system and go through, um, so that you make the most out of that interview. Um, the thing that I’m also saying is that as we get more feedback from people, we’re adding more stuff to it.

Like we had a, someone asked us, how can I outsource this to have my va do everything but the interview and I, that’s a great bonus section. Let’s add that. And then somebody else said, how can we go ahead and repurpose the content? And I’m like, that’s genius. We should add that to the course too. So I’m with this course, you know, you get access to it and then we also email you continual. That sounds bad. We don’t email you continually. We’d go ahead and email you on when updates are put to it. So if there’s new resources, you get those also.

That’s awesome. That’s awesome. So, so again, at interview connections we get you booked as a guest expert so you work with us and we find podcasts that are good fit for you. And it’s also, it’s so great to be doing what Tom is talking about and testing your metrics, figuring out what kinds of shows are a good fit because tom is doing all this. He can come back to us and say, hey listen, these types of podcasts are really great. This a podcast didn’t really generate the right kind of traffic or you know, it wasn’t, was it the best resource? So we can take that information and start honing down and, and looking at different types of podcasts. And the right shows forum, so we are getting you booked, but folks, if you are getting interviewed and you’re not quite seeing the, the listeners convert to leads and the traffic and you’re not seeing the metrics you want, you’ve got to really dig into this marketing information that Tom has really look at your sales funnels because really just getting booked and doing interviews is step one in this whole process. So remind us one more time, Tom, where they can get all that information.

I’m sure you just go to t, m Schwab, that’s spelled s, c h, W A, forward slash rts for roads to success. There’ll be that infographic a, there’ll be information on the course. There’s a place to opt in and there’s also the coupon code there for the, uh, the course that saves you 25 percent on it.

Perfect. And that link will be in the show notes at our And I do want to say, not that I don’t think this makes a huge difference, but I’m not an affiliate so I get no compensation. I genuinely know that Tom knows what he’s talking about. He’s a client of ours. I know that he’s seen success with it, so that is why I am bringing him to you today and encouraging that you go check out this course and get his info graphic because I do believe it will help you, so thank you tom so much for joining us today. Folks, if you enjoyed this episode, visit our ts Subscribe to the show in itunes or stitcher Radio Rhodes to success as a production of interview connections, the premier source for booking outstanding podcast guests. Visit interview To learn more.

Yeah? Yes. Can you.